Why are the values/ principles of scrum manifesto not included in the scrum guide?

Last post 04:07 pm May 22, 2019
by Tom Ottmann
7 replies
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04:19 pm May 20, 2019

Hello everyone,

    Can somebody explain me why is the Scrum Manifesto is not included in the Scrum Guide? 

    And when I face an issue, where should I first look to find the root of my problem and a sustainable solution? Is it the Agile Manifesto with it's 4 values or the scrum guide with it's 4 values? 

    I will be so glad to hear from you.

    Best Wishes.

     

    09:59 am May 21, 2019

    What lead you to believe Agile values are in opposition to Scrum ones?

    What's the difference between them?

    And why do you think these values (whether Agile or Scrum ones) would help you towards resolving an issue?

    05:10 pm May 21, 2019

    I see all of the Agile Manifesto for Software Development values and principles represented in the Scrum Guide.  Is the wording different?  Absolutely. But the basis for the values and principles exist in both. There are always many ways to state the same message and this is an example of such. 

    The premise of the Agile Manifesto for Software Development was to provide a foundation for new ways of addressing software development that allows for delivery of iterative value, embracing change as it occurs and allowing teams at the level doing the work to make decisions on how to do that work. Scrum is all about those same foundational principles. 

    I will also point out that both of them are based on the same base principle of Empiricism. 

    06:55 pm May 21, 2019

    @Daniel Wilhite, So we have 2 independent guides which both have the same purpose (building software in a better way) on the basis of Empiricism. They differ in wording not meaning and in addition to that the scrum manifest provides more detail practises. They do not build upon each other. None of them is better or worse, they are just different  sources with different content. Did I summarized this in my word, correctly?

     

    07:45 pm May 21, 2019

    In my opinion you have it mostly right.  They do build upon each other but not in a way that makes the others wrong or obsolete.  In my reality, they enhance each other as the respect for each grows. 

    But do not take my explanation as the only one.  In the world of agile practitioners, each and everyone of us will have slightly different perspectives on how everything relates.  As you said "none of them are better or worse, they are just different".  Please use everything that anyone says and everything that you can read to form your own opinions and views.  Come back here and share them with us.  We all learn from each other.  And I will admit that the first time you post something and one of the "old timers" comments on your post, it is a real big ego boost.  Even if they tell you that your thoughts are flawed.  Take any constructive input as a good thing. Constantly employ empiricism in your journey to understand and use agile practices in anything you do.  

    08:42 pm May 21, 2019

    Maybe a better approach would be to consider the Agile Manifesto as an umbrella and under that umbrella you have various frameworks such as Kanban and Scrum. They are not necessarily separate or wholly independent of each other because Scrum is just a framework of doing work within the Agile mindset and Agile values. The Scrum Guide is a deeper dive of sorts than the 4 values with the Agile Manifesto. Lastly, and it's a minor point, there are 5 values in Scrum, not 4. Commitment, Courage, Focus, Openness, and Respect.

    01:40 pm May 22, 2019

    So we have 2 independent guides which both have the same purpose (building software in a better way) on the basis of Empiricism. 

    Tobias, it may be easier to think of Agile (Agile Manifesto) and Scrum (Scrum Guide) in the following terms:

    Agile is a software development approach that leverages several "better" practices around communication, collaboration, Lean-thinking, and Empiricism.

    Scrum is an Agile framework (not restricted solely to software development) that fully leverages Empiricism as the basis of its framework.

    Hope this helps.

    04:07 pm May 22, 2019

    Thank you Daniel for your words. They helped me a lot!

     

    We all learn from each other.  (Daniel)

    That's the major reason why I like Agile/ Scrum so much. Progress is more important than being right

     

    Maybe a better approach would be to consider the Agile Manifesto as an umbrella and under that umbrella you have various frameworks such as Kanban and Scrum (Curtis)

    That's a good picture and you are absolutly right, they are 5 values in the scrum guide