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Scrum Vs. DevOps - Any Impact to the framework???

Last post 10:37 am April 3, 2016 by Shahid Aslam
5 replies
09:59 am April 1, 2016

Dear all - As with many folks out there I'm seeing a lot of DevOps buzzwords being banded about some valid others just completely in left field when considering how much an overlap it is to Scrum and further the many views of what it actually is....

I'm curious to know how people feel about this with regards to how this fits into scrum i.e. does anyone think the framework needs to be adjusted in taking in account of operations and its impact or whether the current framework is adequate i.e. possibilities ranging from product owner being from the ops side of the fence or from having development team being op members....

From my perspective I see that Operations, Users, Customers are all different stakeholders of which the product owner cannot truly represent all of them and thus introducing other dimensions whereby some may feel a change in the Scrum framework is needed beyond that of the sprint review / planning....

For example is there room for a fourth role? Or perhaps a notion of project board with chairman, senior supplier, senior user etc in order to complement the framework...

I look forward to hearing of your views ;-)


03:28 pm April 1, 2016

According to its definition, Scrum is a framework for developing and sustaining complex products.
Each Scrum increment is potentially shippable.

Hence, what differences do you see between a DevOps team and a (mature) Scrum Development Team ?


11:25 pm April 1, 2016

In Scrum a Product Owner is accountable for the value and ROI of a product over its entire lifecycle, including any ongoing operational support. A Development Team will have the technical capability to deliver increments throughout the product's existence.

The framework draws no distinction between development and operational support whether in terms of roles and their responsibilities, artifacts, or events. In fact it's hard to think of an approach that bridges the Dev-Ops divide more comprehensively than Scrum.


11:02 am April 2, 2016

To get to potentially shippable and usable increment at the end of each sprint does require the adoption of most of the DevOps practices. What prevents a large majority of the teams, at least in large organizations, from reaching this ideal end state are the org. structures that keep development and operational teams separate.

Any thoughts/opinion on how we can work toward breaking these barriers? I can see that in newer or smaller organizations this may be quite possible but how about large orgs?


10:31 am April 3, 2016


Posted By Olivier Ledru on 01 Apr 2016 03:28 PM
According to its definition, Scrum is a framework for developing and sustaining complex products.
Each Scrum increment is potentially shippable.

Hence, what differences do you see between a DevOps team and a (mature) Scrum Development Team ?



In fact I see quite a few differences... As mentioned Scrum relates to development of new or enhanced capability where as on the Operational side of things are those folks whom support the business infrastructure such as core and other software/databases, servers, networks, databases, admins, etc...

In addition there is also a huge difference between internal and external projects i.e. is the project delivering to a paid customer based on a contract or is this an internal endeavour to improve...

Suffice to say - in most cases I really do not see how Operatioal support staff can be responsible for development. There are exceptions and it does happen but in most cases these are two very distinct different groups... Keep in mind Operational support covers many different software systems, networking, databases etc and as such these resources are typically working in a dynamic demanding environment.

From my experience, I have been a software developer for many years as well as a project manager.. Throughout those years I have observed a disconnect between operational support, users and sponsors.

In my opinion a mature scrum team has the abilty to provide final line support (3rd/4th) with the means to correct bugs or other issues relating to the system which they have developed...

As mentioned/purpose of this thread is to explore the interconnection with dev and op stakeholders and to ask the open question whether scum needs to be adapted... Of course I have my view - but would like to solicit other opinions as this is for sure an interesting subject noting the latest trends of banding about the "DevOps" buzzword ;-)


10:37 am April 3, 2016


Posted By Ian Mitchell on 01 Apr 2016 11:25 PM
In Scrum a Product Owner is accountable for the value and ROI of a product over its entire lifecycle, including any ongoing operational support. A Development Team will have the technical capability to deliver increments throughout the product's existence.

The framework draws no distinction between development and operational support whether in terms of roles and their responsibilities, artifacts, or events. In fact it's hard to think of an approach that bridges the Dev-Ops divide more comprehensively than Scrum.



Nice one! In particular the last sentence lol... I'm inclined to agree that the product owner is the conduit for operational support issues to be channeled into the development team and hence this could be a bottle neck unless other processes, artifacts or events are brought into play... I'm sure a holistic approach can be adopted given the vast differences between organisations hence why I raised the question whether scrum could be expanded to address that somehow ;-)


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